The East Contra Costa Fire Protection District responded to a total of 526 service calls in the month of March, with an average response time of 7:04 minutes.
In the month of February the District ran 496 calls with an average response time of 6:58 minutes. In the calendar year of 2013, the District ran 6454 calls for service with an average response time of 7:08.
Looking at the response times by stations:
- Station 52-John Muir Parkway, Brentwood, had 165 calls in the month of March with an average response time of 6:19minutes. In February there were a total of 153 calls with an average response time of 6:11 minutes. In the calendar year of 2013 the station ran 1857 calls for service with an average response time of 6:26.
- Station 54-Downtown Brentwood, had 82 calls in the month of March with an average response time of 6:18 minutes. In February there were a total of 98 calls with an average response time of 6:06 minutes. In the calendar year of 2013 the station ran 1336 calls for service with an average response time of 6:28.
- Station 59-1685 Bixler Rd, Discovery Bay, had 57 calls in the month of March with an average response time of 8:18 minutes. In February there were a total of 69 calls with an average response time of 8:07 minutes. In the calendar year of 2013 the station ran 774 calls for service with an average response time of 8:54.
- Station 93 530 O’Hare Ave, Oakley, had 161 calls in the month of March with an average response time of 6:37 minutes. In February there were a total of 133 calls with an average response time of 6:47 minutes. In the calendar year of 2013 the station ran 1752 calls for service with an average response time of 6:16.
- Station 94-15 A St, Knightsen, had 14 calls in the month of March with an average response time of 8:07 minutes. In February there were a total of 5 calls with an average response time of 7:01 minutes. In the calendar year of 2013 the station ran 17 6 calls for service with an average response time of 8:30.
- Station 95-3045 Ranch Ln, Bethel Island (closed 7-1-2012), had 36 calls in the area of this closed station in the month of March with an average response time of 11:56 minutes. In the month of February there were 24 calls with an average response time of 11:52 minutes. In the calendar year of 2013 the District ran 355 calls for service in the station area with an average response time of 11:31.
- Cal-Fire Station 16-Marsh Creek/Morgan Territory had 11 calls in the month of Marchwith an average response time of 8:22 minutes. In February there were a total of 14 calls with an average response time of 12:27 minutes. In the calendar year of 2013 the station ran 195 calls for service with an average response time of 9.25.
Auto aid:
In the month of March, the District received auto aid from Contra Costa County Fire 26 times, with them sending 31 engines. The District sent auto aid to Contra Costa County Fire 12 times providing them with 15 engines. During the month of February, Contra Costa County Fire came into the District 26 times with 30engines and we responded into Contra Costa County Fire 17 times with 21 engines. In 2013, the District received auto aid from Contra Costa County Fire 345 times with them sending 476 engines. The District sent auto aid to Contra Costa County Fire a total of 198 times in 2012, sending 234 engines.
50 comments
The stats are great to know. Maybe this daily news site should print out the most recent fiasco in the ECCFPD that will provide a thousand dollar sign up bonus and a five percent raise for veteran management employees. But wait, that’s not all there is more. Uniform and training allowance too. You might think this money that the district does not have would go to the low paid firefighters that truly deserve it. Nope, it goes on top of the six figure income of the three battalion chiefs. The slap in the face to the low paid firefighter will just reduce moral that much more. This definitely is the worst time to ask for a tax and give the higher paid employees a raise right before they stick their hand out to the public.
Wow Chuck, You really are uninformed. A perfect example of most of the people who have negative feedback. Have you even looked at the budgets? The uniform and training allowance were already benefits that they were getting and had been for years. All the board did was roll them into their salary. The battalion chiefs have not had raises for many years and they hardly make a six figure income. They are paid less than entry level firefighters in the rest of the county. I think total it’s costing the district about 7000.00 more a year. That is a small amount in order to reward the people who are doing excellent work with the little support of the community they have. Including yours. Try reading a bit before posting. It may make you look better…or not.
How does a 5% increase and rolling uniform and training expenses affect pension calculations?
And isn’t that $7k an estimate put forth by the district for the portion of 2014 only?
Do you have any idea how much the agreement will cost next year?
Wow David you are really more uninformed. You missed the point so I will explain it again. Before I do, you are very wrong that the battalion chiefs bring in under six figures. It is public record if you want to look. Now to explain my point so even you can hopefully understand. The firefighters on the line make about thirteen dollars an hour according to a previous blog on this site. That is less than half of what a battalion chief makes. This has nothing to do with the current battalion chiefs as they are great at their job. For the district to beg the public for more money while sneaking in a thousand dollar signing bonus and five percent raise for the already highest paid people is an insult to the integrity of the public. It is even more of an insult to the on line firefighters who make less than half of what they do. So, David you say they are entitled to a raise even if the district is going broke. That is the dumbest statement I have heard. The next thing you will expect for the highest paid people is to close another station and lay off the lowest paid firefighters. This is the kind of mentality used by selfish entitlement people. If there is any extra money use it for the on line low underpaid firefighters. That’s the point David.
Chuck, you really need to cut the BS. The data base for all ECCFPD is easy to acess as is that for any other fire department in the bay area. ECCFPD pays the lowest for all positions when compared to that of their counterparts through out the region. You are picking an argument that you cannot possibly win
East County Battalion Chiefs make a Base salary of 88,125 ( sorry Charlie, but that is short of 6 figures ). And before you get started lets keep it apples to apples- overtime doesn’t count, nor do the other benefits that all employees receive no matter where they work or what they do.
Con Fire Battalion chiefs make a Base salary of $142,267, San Ramon Fire Batallion Chiefs make a Base salary of 144,756 and Alameda Country Fire Battalion Chiefs make a Base salary of $145,956 ( ALL 6 figures ) Respectively.
Get YOUR facts straight Chuckie. That’s MY point
Hey 2 buck chuck. Speaking on behalf of those that have to foot the bill for these services I think you need to understand that we feel your Total Cost of Employment (TCOE) is absolutely insane. Cry in your soup all you want but the fact that the 4 Battalion Chiefs cost nearly a quarter million dollars EACH per year to employ is absolutely insane. Obviously you have a vested interest in maintaining the status quo but look where that has gotten us.
Lewis, do we assume then that when you speak about your own compensation you speak ONLY in terms of TCOE?
If you do(long odds) that would at least put you above the dishonest hacks over at the CCTImes who prefer to cherry pick facts when comparing public to private sector jobs.
Nobody is getting rich off $90k salary in the Bay Area and you’re a fool if you think otherwise.
You don’t get to dictate what professional fire fighters make anymore than you get to dictate what the CEO of Walmart makes. Sorry, Bud. If you don’t see value in the service, don’t pay for it. Just don’t whine when you’re in need but having to do without.
Buy a Clue Get a Clue! I guess the disconnect is where you feel that public servants are not accountable to their masters. By saying “You don’t get to dictate what professional fire fighters make anymore than you get to dictate what the CEO of Walmart makes” shows you have no regard to whom actually makes the ECCFPD exist in the first place let alone understand the difference between the private and public sector. I know you and the corrupt unions that “support” politicians tied together with CALPERS make the whole sickening system feed off each other to the disappointment of its citizens.
You are and the system are financially and morally bankrupt.
BTW where can I sign up for the “If you don’t see value in the service, don’t pay for it” option? Does not exist does it?
Why Are you and 2 Buck Mud Duck trying to change the issue here. Lets repeat the issue for the short bus people. If you have extra money in a district that does not have any extra money you do not give it to the highest paid people when you can apply it to the lowest under paid people. Quit being jerks and stop the bait and switch bs. The commission and battalion chiefs snuck a raise and a sign up bonus in for the wrong group. This is just another example of a wayward lost leadership that will never get it right. It is just like Vince Wells said. Its time to merge with con fire. There is no help in sight under this leadership.
Lewis & Chuck (Dumb & Dumber),
When you are dead, you don’t know that you are dead, so It is difficult only for others.
It is the same when you are stupid.
Stop the insanity.
Lewis, thanks for underscoring my point. With the bonus of showing what a POS you are.
You are not “Master” of anyone in the public or private sector, regardless of whether you pay their salary directly or indirectly. We abolished slavery 150 years ago, Dude. Apparently you never got the memo.
Multiple times in this thread it has been pointed out to you and your buddy Chuck that BCs don’t make 6 figures. But you continue to repeat the lie while failing to make honest comparisons to similar private sector jobs even when directly asked.
If you run a business or walk through life with that attitude toward others, you must be a piece of work. Suggests you either got bullied a lot when young or abused, perhaps. That or you’re just an a-hole by choice.
That BS corrupt union line is typical for people with your mentality. Because your ultimate goal is to further impoverish more people and further crush the middle class. With the intent that somehow you are going to be standing over those people at the end of the day dictating how they will live their lives
Sick stuff.
You and your buddy Chuckie have this fascination with failure thing going on. You’re drawn to it. Again, because you think it will somehow empower you over others. That’s not the spirit that our Country was founded on. We need FEWER people who think like you at the table solving problems and MORE people with a rising tide lifts all ships mentality.
You’re either a corporatist shill or just a loser trying to drag others down. Doesn’t really matter which. People like you are never part of the solution. You are the lion’s share of the problem.
You have yourself a nice day, Lewis. Try not to take it out on the dog or the wife for a change.
What Chu Talking ’bout Lewis???
For starters you DON’T speak on behalf of those that “foot the bill”. I happen to foot the bill and I can tell you, that you DON’T speak for me (I probably pay more than you do). \
My Total Cost of Employment? Sorry Louie but I don’t work for the fire department. I am a TAXPAYER and one that appreciates the VALUE and SERVICE that we have enjoyed up to this point. If you don’t comprende, that is your misfortune. We pay less for fire services that ANYONE else in the bay area and yet you want to cut salary’s even more? Sounds like you would have been a dandy employer had you had the chance. Incase you were wondering, Federal laws on employment and pay are written as protection against people like you.
Now back to the Salaries and TCOE of the fire battalion chiefs. First you should come clean with those you are trying to mislead and let them know for the actual coverage that is necessitated by ECCFPD we actually need at least another 3 to 4 battalion chiefs, 5 more stations and a helluva lot more firefighters. You and I aren’t paying 1/2 of what we should be for adequate protection!
Let me spell it out for you Lew. That puts YOU and I and our families at risk. But what you haven’t realized in your quest to save a dime, is that it also puts the firefighters (and Battalion Chiefs) at an increased risk. I guess that’s ok as long as you are thinking you are saving money.
Lewis, all jobs have a “hidden” TCOE but since these are public sector you get to see the breakdown. What is a crime is that all it does is give you a false sense of what you actually pay. At an average of 5 percent of your total property taxes that means you probably pay somewhere around $200 a year into the entire department. Let’s think that through. There are 5 stations 3 ffs per shift at each station (9 x 5 = 45 f/fs). Near as I can figure there are 3 battalion chiefs and one chief (no assistant or deputy chiefs) so that is 4, plus possibly a admin person. So we are talking about 50 employees? Now add in buildings, equipment, and maintenance costs and you are probably getting the picture of how far your contribution went. If you were just paying for salaries your 200.00 divided by 50 employees is four bucks each during any given year! Divide that by the 3000 hrs. they work in a year and I’m thinking maybe 1/100 of a cent of your tax dollar makes it to their hourly rate/salaries? Lets go nuts and say that you contribute one whole cent. Wow, their individual COE is really crushing you as the tax payer huh?
Problem is the financial joke is on you. The insurance industry is doing a current survey in east county.
And guess what pal…..Survey says, YOU and I are gonna pay more when it comes to our insurance premiums. Check it out for yourself: http://www.contracostatimes.com/east-county-times/ci_25523061/east-contra-cosa-fire-district-undergoes-review-that
Now doesn’t that make you feel proud of your position? C’mon champ, we would love to hear you talk your way out of this…..because like it or not, you are gonna pay one way or the other. Its the cost of living here. Fire protection amongst other things like life safety isn’t cheap. The reality is that we should be paying almost TRIPLE to get the service that most people think they deserve. That is insane. You, not thinking it though is INSANE.
No one in the ECCFPD is getting rich-they are getting by
2 Buck Duck, You are really being a dumb duck. It took about four minutes to find out that before this as you say entitled raise and sign up the three battalion chiefs in east county that is on the verge of bankruptcy cost the district as follows each;
BC J.G. costs the ECCFPD $ 223,620. dollars in 2012, BC J.B. cost the ECCFPD $ 222,245. dollars, and the third BC B.H. cost the ECCFPD $ 204,638. in the same year. I could not find the cost of a regular on the line firefighter. By the looks of this the on line firefighter makes only a third of this from what they claim.
So, 2 Buck DA Duck you ntgalastfu or get some common sense. Lewis has common sense. Borrow some of his.
Chuckster, you still don’t get it. The employee doesn’t CONTROL those costs, nor do they “take home” anything near the TCOE you are touting. Face it dude, your tactics have been exposed. Our Batallion chiefs have a salary of 88k a year. My plumber, painter, mechanic and even my landscaper each make more than that a year. Imagine what their TCOE is? Too bad there isn’t a data base for private industry.
In the meantime-
Let’s compare like job titles, or even lesser job titles shall we? According to the public salary data base http://www.mercurynews.com/salaries/bay-area/2012 a fire captain (a job title BELOW that of a battalion chief) has a total cost of employment TCOE of $404,182. That’s almost TWICE of the figure that has you tweaking. That’s right Chuck, TWICE! …………………..Oh the humanity!
That must really chap your hide! And wait, there is more, much more. You see Chuckie-Cheese, all types of employees including planners, attorneys, nurses, administrators, clerks, department personnel, engineers make huge, “6 figure” amounts when you add all the costs related to employment. It’s not rocket science Chuck. If you want to retain employees, you have to be competitive. Why is it I’m sensing you are not a rocket scientist, business owner, or make a “6 figure salary”.
I’ll bet you twitch when you hear what football, baseball or basket ball players get paid for playing a game. (Their TCOE would give you an aneurism). Do you whine about that too? You know you pay into their TCOE right? Yep, every time you consume something they are pitching or purchase anything that is advertised during the game.
In our next installment, I’ll explain what “take home” pay is. I promise to type S-L-O-W just for you
Seriously. The difference between your Plumber, Painter, Mechanic and Landscaper is that they probably don’t make $88K on average and certainly they don’t make on average of another $20K in overtime (I digress but why do salaried employees in the private sector make only the salary per month regardless of the hours put in but public employees have a “salary” and still collect overtime?).
Add another $70K to that sum for the public being on the hook for the lavish pension gift and pay even more in differed comp scams etc. etc. etc. and we are back to the quarter million dollar fireman.
Other than “public safety” servants name one other group that has a structure like this/
Lewis, you and your buddy Chuckie really are a special blend of stupid.
Limits on overtime for salaried employees in the private sector are embedded in law. Those laws are outdated and often abused by Corporate America. President Obama signed an Executive Order within the last 30 days to rectify some of that in his ongoing efforts to attack the growing income inequality problem in this County. Maybe you should follow the news more?
You rail on these middle class public safety workers and effectively suggest that the 40% budget deficit should be resolved on their backs. But not once in this discussion have any of you CCTPA drones offered comparatives from the private sector. This most recent half-baked attempt is as close as you’ve ever come.
I guess you have never heard of profit sharing or stock options? The name is not the same, so in your limited intelligence I’m gonna guess that you can’t connect the dots on that one.
When, officially, did it become sport for you CoCo Taxpayers Ass drones to rail on the middle class when the real funding problems are at the top? Corporate tax contributions to running this Country are down 75% from what they were 40 years ago. Yet they and their lackies(you appear to be included) continue campaigns to further reduce revenue or starve government.
The budget shortfall of our fire districts is not going to be resolved by insisting the workforce take a 40% haircut in compensation. And until you and the Chuckster get a clue and start speaking with some integrity and fairness in your public-private sector comparisons, people like me are going to show up to point out your lies and hypocrisy.
Start quoting comprehensive TCOE comparatives from the private sector or stop using the term. It’s really pretty simple. This tactic of using data only from one side in a dishonest manner is how you clowns roll. Take your lies back over to the CCTimes site or BGR’s cesspool where they are more appreciated.
Even the quarter of a million dollar fireman is entitled to a raise according to the 2 Buck Duck. No wonder we are robbing our kids of any type future. 17 Trillion in debt and climbing. Dumb Mud Duck probably voted for Obama twice too.
Chuck,
When you are dead, you don’t know that you are dead, so It is difficult only for others.
It is the same when you are stupid.
Congratulations 2 buck buck you won the name calling contest. Try using facts and sound logic next time. Game over
I’d actually say Buy A Clue and 2 buck chuck have brought a lot more truth and facts to the discussion than you two clowns.
All I’m hearing is envy spewing from your mouths.
Hence the name Troll. 2 Buck Duck, what are you trying to say in that last blurb? Something about being dead and not knowing. What a bright intelligent statement. Now it shows you voted twice for Obama.There are so many mud ducks out there today.You probably have a hard time balancing your check book when there are checks left.
Chuck, isn’t it obvious? 2 buck chuck is saying that you and your alias “Lewis” are stupid, but since you are both demonstrating severe bouts of stupidity you don’t get it. You both unwittingly proved his point! Hysterical.
Neither you are Lewis posted anything of substance. You both sound like the frustrated wackadoodle from Knightsen.
I have to side with “Brentwood troll” and Buy a Clue. Hard to believe someone would post in the manner that you do. How old are you, seven? (No offense to the seven year olds out there).
ECV, 2BuckChuck and BuyAClue,
You all have done a great job explaining exactly how things are. These other guys just don’t get it. They are uninformed and refuse to actually educate themselves as well as not rooting themselves into reality. Its kind of sad really that all their hate and hostility has to be brought down on our public safety workers who are doing their absolute best to protect our families, homes and community with very little support and compensation. They deserve all the compensation they are getting and I only wish they could get more. Hopefully someday they will. Until then I applaud them, the administration and the board. They are all attempting to do good work even with the negativity that surrounds them.
David, you promote ECV, 2bc, and BAC as great communicators and describe the other guys as “hate and hostility”.
Do you not see the ugliness in the posts that you promote?
I believe most people are unimpressed by bloggers’ name calling and other personal attacks and I think that is one reason that ECV and company have proven to be electorally unpersuasive.
No, they have not done a great job of explaining exactly how things are. They have once again missed an opportunity to gracefully persuade not only Chuck and Lewis, but more importantly, most anyone who happens to read their comment. I’m sure they appreciate your “compliment”, but that warm feeling does nothing to further what I understand to be your mutual goal.
I join you in applauding the firefighters, the administration and the board for their efforts in these difficult times. However, I would rather read about the board’s efforts to find additional revenue rather than a narrowly focused compensation increase. Wouldn’t it be nice to see some action on a county wide sales tax increase to help with county EMS issues?
I see you’re drinking John Gonzales kool-aid.
Maybe you should do a little research on your sales tax idea. Specifically look at San Ramon where a lawsuit has been initiated over a proposed tax that will not result in an increase in services.
That’s illegal. Precedent was set by the California Supreme Court about 5 years ago on this subject in the SVTA vs. Santa Clara Open Space case.
You and your buddy John were asked about the legality of this idea when it was first floated. I think the answer is fairly obvious for anyone paying attention. Once again your avoidance of the question was telling.
Since you continue to float this idea of someone beside yourself shouldering much of the burden of fixing the revenue shortfall, Couple that with the classic whiny tone of your post and I’ll go on the assumption your name is Don.
There are areas of the County that have no need for a sales tax to supplement their fire services. So it must be presumed you were intending to illegally move the money to the most critical situation in East County.
Might be time for you to cycle through another alias now that you wore out the credibility of this one so quickly.
Press Release, your issues of denial and the transparency of your efforts are just plain silly. It’s the same old predictable song and dance coming from you, but you are so stricken with denial that you expect everyone else to turn a blind eye. Sorry, but in the real world, it isn’t as simple as that.
Your typical postings which always have your signature attempt to tell everyone how they think, immediately gives you away. Yours is a sign of ugliness that is beyond reproach. Myself and others post; truths, facts, and back up documentation and all you can reply with is recycled innuendo. I believe even the casual reader here sees right through you. Obviously, I give readers here more credit than you do.
What, did you think, readers here couldn’t decide for themselves who was name calling, acting juvenile or not addressing specific facts? No amount of cover up or deflection on your part dismisses their behavior. Or yours for that matter.
“Two Buck Mud Duck”, “Short Bus People”, “Get a Clue”, “Servants”, “2 Buck D(umb) A(ss) Duck” , “2 Buck Buck” and “cronies” etc., are a few of the names used in “name calling” by the very people you are pathetically trying to defend and promote. Guess that was a convenient oversight on your part? You still want us to think you are in the business of gracefull persuasion? You are a riot!
If you think my intent or anyone else’s is to “persuade” the likes of Chuck/Louis, then you really are in over your head in your limited assessment.
One last word of advice, posting on a blog over and over about a non existent county “EMS issues” and a non starter countywide sales tax does nothing but waste everyone’s time-including yours. Perhaps if you figure that out someday, a meaningful dialogue might have hope of taking place. But you and I know that’s not going to happen as long as you think you can BS the casual reader here. It’s always the same with you, So it continues.
You are stuck in your own irony.
If you read the minutes I believe the Board is doing everything they legally are able to, to find revenue. I have not seen anyone come up with any new ideas to obtain new revenue. All I see is how much they complain about the pay and pensions. Well those are not going anywhere, accept it and move on. We can wish, want and fantasize that revenue can come from sales tax or thin air. That doesn’t mean its going to happen. The only way that another avenue of income will open up is if the state changes the current tax laws. That is just not going to happen. I am seeing a lot of people complaining, crying, being hateful and hostile. What I haven’t seen is solutions other than what is out there. I am all for compensating people for the job they do and I see no reason to punish them for problems that are out of their control. I don’t think the “narrow” compensation increase is going to affect much except to make the FF feel good about the job they do and motivate them to stay. I am perfectly willing to pay more in property tax to make that happen. It will be cheaper than the insurance rate increase.
David,
I appreciate where you’re coming from, but a half cent sales tax may be more viable than you are giving credit. Why do you think it would violate state law?
The main objection from the CCC BOS has not been the legality, but rather a desire to use the potential sales tax increase (now allowed by a change in state law limiting the total sales tax in any area) for another transportation authority sales tax planned for the November ballot.
The idea for a sales tax to support county EMS has been brought to the fire district and the BOS. This isn’t a fire tax idea, it’s an EMS sales tax idea. Funds are needed for the entire EMS system including ER, trauma centers, transport, first responders, and dispatch.
Let me ask you this: would you like the district and BOS to explore an EMS sales tax increase, and if it’s legal/possible would you support that over a sales tax increase to fund the county transportation authority?
@press release
‘Buy a clue’ answered your question regarding legality. His answer provided a qualifier in case law yet you continue to believe it is viable. You suggest that the sales tx idea has already been brought in front of the Board of Supes and you claim to know their objections. In the name of transparency where can I find that dialogue? Everything they do is captured as public record and available for review. I was unaware that EMS needs additional funding and additional sales taxes were being considered. Could you point me to the source of your information?
Hi Stan,
BAC’s didn’t answer my question. I asked why David thinks a half cent sales tax for EMS would violate state law.
You can contact any of the Supervisors’ offices for more information about their position on an EMS sales tax as well as whether or not county EMS needs additional funding. Sadly, because the Supervisors have different priorities, I don’t think this is being considered.
You may also wish to contact the county Transportation Authority for information about their planned sales tax increase for the November ballot.
@press release
I am a little befuddled by your response. I am sure it was not your intention to deliberately dodge my questions.
I thought the questions were straight-forward, so I’ll retry.
I asked specifically “where can I find the dialogue” that identifies the sales tx idea being brought to the Board of Supes for their consideration. I additionally asked specifically, how you (claimed) to know of their objections. Two questions.
You replied that I could contact the Supervisors. While I know that is my right, it did nothing to answer my questions. My questions were directed at you because you made claims that by all intents and purposes would be a matter of public record. Many people here seem to have little problem linking to such things. I was hoping you could save me a lot of time searching for what you claimed.
You now have added another comment, that much to your disappointment, “Sadly” the Supes have different priorities.
Personally I’m not a fan of any additional blanket taxes including increasing our sales tax. So for me I wouldn’t have labeled it “Sadly” but I have to ask what other priorities do they (the Supes) have that you are aware of? Is it actually public record or are you just putting words into their mouths? If you have proof, a lot of us here would like to see it for ourselves. No offense, but I don’t trust those that operate off of projection of their own ideas. Unfortunately that seems to be what is going on here.
My understanding of sales tax is basic. There are local (city) sales taxes which would be levied locally for local services to a countywide sales tax. On the other hand the existing countywide sales tax must be used specifically for countywide services. Fire services and to some degree EMS doesn’t qualify for a countywide tx, due to the number of fire districts which are not “County” and EMS which is funded by a special measure. To complicate matters, at least two fire departments, San Ramon and Orinda/Moraga have their own EMS transport and neither are County. While my understanding is simple, taxes and funding are not.
If you are looking for simple answers to complicated tax and law questions here on a blog, I suggest you focus your efforts in an entirely different direction. David V’s opinion while important really isn’t going to resolve your legal quandary. You might take your own advice and “contact any of the Supervisors’ offices for more information”.
Hopefully you can take another stab at honestly answering my questions including another; why did you bring EMS funding into the discussion when the issue at hand is fire department funding?
Hi Stan,
BAC didn’t answer my question. I asked why David thinks a half cent sales tax for EMS would violate state law.
You can contact any of the Supervisors’ offices for more information about their position on an EMS sales tax as well as whether or not county EMS needs additional funding. Sadly, because the Supervisors have different priorities, I don’t think this is being considered.
You may also wish to contact the county Transportation Authority for information about their planned sales tax increase for the November ballot.
@press release,
It appears you posted the same thing twice.
*see my response above.
Hi Stan,
You mention several things and I will respond in no particular order. But first, I am still waiting for David’s answer to my two question:
1) what does David believe a county wide EMS sales tax would violate state law?
2) would David prefer a county wide EMS sales tax to yet another county wide transportation authority tax increase?
When I said “Sadly the Supes have different priorities” the point is the priority, not the new tax. These Supes are going to put a sales tax ballot measure before the voters in November anda heather you believe in more taxes or not, it’s the prioritization that I find sad. For me, public safety (spelled E M S) is a higher priority than the goals of the county transportation authority. I would absolutely agree with your dislike for any bucket tax; that is not what was suggested.
As for the validity of an EMS revenue shortfall, can anyone read this and not conclude we have an EMS funding problem?
http://i0.wp.com/eastcountytoday.net/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/ECCFPDFlyer1.jpg
This come from the ECCFPD, one of the major providers of EMS in the county.
And how can we know if the BOS has been graced with the suggestion of a county wide EMS sales tax? This very website posted a copy of a letter sent to the BOS and ECCFPD suggesting it:
https://eastcountytoday.net/letter-fix-our-financially-failing-fire-districts-county-wide/
You shouldn’t take my word for this. And you really shouldn’t take some of these other posters’ word for anything. Send a Supe an email. I suggest you start with the Supes who sit on the. CCC transportation authority.
And don’t stop there, send Vince Wells and Hugh Henderson an email and ask them about county EMS funding shortages and whether they are interested in a potential county wide EMS sales tax increase.
One more thing…it looks to me like people have confused property tax with sales tax. They have almost nothing in common and the laws that govern each are completely different. An interesting fact is that we currently have a window because the state legislature has just increased the cap on sales tax. That’s why and how the transportation authority is poised to float their sales tax increase. If they get it, the window will be closed for an EMS sales tax forever (well, nothing is forever)
Please though, don’t form your opinions from ANY anonymous post on this blog.
David, you and your cronies continue to miss the point over and over and continue to have no offer or plan. You just mouth off with no constructive subject to contribute.The breakdown of this chat was assuming the issue was wages only. There is much more focusing on the line firefighters that deserve any extra money first. You and your cronies can manipulate and twist words as much as you want. The fact remains what it is. The money is gone, the commission is afraid to act, the county could care less, and the people are tired of being taxed to death. My comment was about getting any available money to a 40K firefighter and not a 100K and sign bonus battalion chief. No disrespect to battalion chiefs but when you have a finite amount of money you apply it the most logical way. You just don’t have a clue.So if anyone is crying, it is you and the other cronies that fail to come to a mutual plan and implement it. Talk is cheap as we see here.
Talk about missing the point……………
This “taxed to death” line, Chuckie.
Precisely or even approximately. How many times have you had a tax increase on your fire services here in CoCo County?
For the bonus question; how much are you paying into fire services today versus 5 or 6 years ago?
Let’s see if you’re simply a new foot solider in the drama queen club or if you can actually differentiate and discuss as an adult.
Queue the crickets.
Wasting internet bandwidth over a small issue when a deadly serious larger issue looms(40% budget shortfall) doesn’t strike me as particularly “logical” or “common sense”. Which you fellas claim you have boatloads of.
Your sales tax plan has every indication that it would be illegal. The consolidation idea eliminates precisely 2 positions in ECCFPD(the Chief and one administrative person) while at the same time potentially diluting resources from ConFire. In other words, no meaningful savings or maintenance of service levels.
Maybe common sense and logic means something different in your neighborhood?
Chuck,
I never knew I was a crony. Who knew??? How does that work again??????
You need to know that I have never met David V but if I did I would gladly shake his hand and thank him for his service. He gets it. You don’t. Too bad.
Buy a Clue and ECV,
Thanks for adding some rationale to the topic. I wouldn’t expect a rational reply from Chuck or the Press release guy though. They don’t understand your questions or don’t wish to answer them because it makes them look bad.
Press release,
I unfriend you.
2 Buck, What service does David do for you? For Clue, I pay much more now since I just bought an overpriced house. Real Estate prices are going through the roof. It will not be long and the fire districts will be back in high cotton. I just realized why you two meatballs respond the way you do. You want there to be confusion and chaos so nothing gets accomplished and you can get the attention your lacking in your lonely lives.
Chuck,
From the depth of David’s postings I presumed he is a firefighter or emergency service person. I could be wrong but above that he has lent some extremely intelligent statements on this forum therefor my appreciation was twofold.
Sorry to hear that you overpaid for your home. Not everyone can understand simple housing economics and the rules of supply and demand. What was lost on you is the percentage of what you pay for fire service hasn’t changed in almost 40 yrs! No one but you made the choice for buying up into that overpriced house of yours.
If you want to see the perfect example someone bring confusion and chaos to the subject of fire department funding look no further than “press release’s” and John Gonzales’ postings. Talk about driftin’ off into the cotton….whew-weeee! Those boys have had a double helping of stupid.
…..and speaking of food and such,
Meatballs are plural. You might want to think of a better word if you are trying to label people as lonely. Besides, I love meatballs.
To Mr. Buy Clue,
I hear you have commented using my name. Let me respond to your comments to show that you are wrong and not the legal guru you think in your own mind. Here are a couple examples to show that a sales tax idea is legal and is being proposed right now. The Kool-Aid I drink is honest and well-meant unlike your Kool-Aid spiked with lies and bs that you are pass. It is people like you that are negatively influencing the public to keep the fire district from moving forward. You should be ashamed at yourself.
Examples of sales tax proposals; Your apology is not needed nor wanted
I am confident that a sales tax would not only pass, it would greatly assist ECCFPD immediate problem.
March 5th west county times
SAN PABLO — Local voters will decide in June whether to authorize a quarter-cent sales tax hike to fund increased emergency medical services in the city.
The City Council unanimously supported the tax proposal, which would raise the sales tax in the city from 9 percent to 9.25 percent, because of what leaders call “immediate threats to public safety,” including the potential closure of an area hospital and fire station.
Fire Station #70 could face closure because of the Contra Costa Fire District’s fiscal troubles, said City Manager Matt Rodriguez.
By CRYSTAL SIMMONS
The Cy-Fair Fire Department is asking the community to approve a 1-cent sales tax increase to help the department accommodate growth in the area
Madison Co. leaders offer sales tax project proposals
FIRE CONTRACT RENEWED
The board renewed an annual contract with the 11 volunteer fire departments. The county provides one mill of revenue — typically between $600,000 and $700,000 — to be split among the departments based on the population in their coverage area.
Extra-cent Sales Tax Proposed
Plan Would Revamp Ems,
January 25, 1995|By BUDDY NEVINS Staff Writer
A county commissioner is proposing an extra-penny sales tax to help with two of Broward County’s biggest problems outmoded paramedic system.
Mr. Clue, There are several more examples. You just need to be a willing player to solve the fire districts problems. Now run along to San Pablo and tell them they are totally illegal in trying to fix their fire/ems problems. May you can take Supervisor Piepho with you.
Legal Guru?
John, I thought you were a rebar salesman. I had no idea you were a Comedian!
I’ll help you out a little with the fuzzy facts that you’re obviously struggling with. Start by reading the actual staff report from San Pablo:
http://www.sanpabloca.gov/documentcenter/view/3881
Where one with any degree of objective reading can see that a)the proposal will result in a new service that will overlap existing services and b)it is independent of the fire department. To the degree that that San Pablo City Council is trying to put it in place in the event the fire station is closed. Now how they came to the idea the busiest station in ConFire could be closed is beyond me.
This point is not up for debate, John. It’s right there in the report. They are planning a $1M service that requires buying new equipment and staffing with 2 Paramedics.
Scale that San Pablo idea back to ECCFPD pay structures and instead of a million, let’s say $800k/station. That’s $4M you need to come up with via Knightsin(sic) bake sales to fund the idea for ECCFPD.
Now I could go into deeper details on that report, like where in the hell is the supposed cost savings? It briefly mentions gas mileage difference between a large fire engine and a smaller squad truck. I’ve pointed that out on this very forum previously. So where is this oodles and oodles of cost savings? You and your buddy Don who is hiding under his Press Release alias have been asked this many times.
Cat still got your tongues?
Stand alone Paramedics don’t put out fires, John. Talk to your contacts at AMR if you’re still not sure. No hoses on the meat wagon should have been your first clue.
So this completely hairbrain idea that you can replace the fire department or supplant them with these 2 man Paramedic rigs is flawed on its face.
The staff report linked above is VERY CLEAR to differentiate. It’s for EMS service. It’s not for fire. Otherwise it would be a Prop 218 violation. But you and Don, if you’re at all true to your well documented history, will attempt to gloss over that detail.
The analogy has been given to you multiple times before. The fire department is like insurance. It must be in place and at the ready at all times. The staff report again relied on that weak argument of 83% medical calls. That does not excuse or in any way diminish the need to have a fire department in place 100% of the time.
What the hell do I know. Maybe you’re one of those guys who thinks you can save a buck by demanding you pay less for your car or your health insurance because you only need it in place 17% of the time.
But look who I’m talking to expecting a logical answer………….
Madison Co , I would presume, is Wisconsin. Broward in Florida. Far as I know neither has a Howard Jarvis initiated Proposition 218 type law in place and that is at the core of the legal issue. So your comparison falls flat on its face.
A cheat set for you two fellas. Print it out and staple it to your monitors
Simple majority passage = money goes to general fund
2/3 majority passage special tax = money to specific purpose
Ask the nice folks in Antioch if it’s important which path take(Measure C).
Since 40% of those polled this year replied “no way” to a special tax to fund fire, I would say you’re fighting an uphill battle. That 40%, btw, is before your friends at the CoCo Tax club show up in organized opposition to any ballot measure.
I’m not sure why you think those voters would appreciate the Don and John show trying to disguise it as an EMS tax then use it for fire. But if you want to stick your neck out there, John, knock yourself out.
Johnny, when did you get a Secretary who screens your blog readings? What’s with that “I hear….” nonsense you opened with?
Again with the “I hear you have commented using my name” opener? Why can you just man up and admit the truth. No one believes that tired old line. What’s next, “the dog ate my homework”? “My Grandma died”?
Looks like Johnny is still grappling with his anger management issues. Some things never change. Perhaps someday he will get over Supervisor Piepho kicking him out if her office and tendering his resignation. Thank you Supervisor Piepho!!!!
Quoting news articles from other states is not the best move in trying to debate an issue. As we all know, The news isn’t the most reliable these days and other states have different rules and laws in regards to taxation. If you want to debate you really need to use facts from actual minutes and reports. Otherwise it just looks like you are being emotional and trying to cloud the issues. You may need to buckle down and do some more research.
Man, all you guys really twisted my first comment. Remember in grade school when we told a secret to the next person and so on ? By the time it got back to the first person the entire secret vanished and a whole new story was told. I was just saying that the firefighters should get any extra money if raises were to go out. You guys turned into vultures feeding on each other.
Chuck, here’s a thought.
Maybe it’s not all about you?
Particularly since your comment was off topic to begin with. Don’t act all surprised when the crowd doesn’t feel like following you off into the weeds.
I was thinkin the same thing JigsUp…. 2 kinds of people: those that debate how things actually work and those like Chuck, Louis and press release who come across with differing motives.
Once rebuffed and exposed, they cry foul or go silent. I’ve seen examples of both here.
Don’t fret JigsUp. They will show up again…. just like bad pennies.
OK 2 Buck, a penny for you. I kind of think the sales tax thing is good. I too was curious if it would be legal so I surfed a bit and found several places in California that use it or propose it. Con Fire would benefit the most but all the county would get benefit from it. This is what I found.
Measure O funds nearly tapped out
.25-cent sales tax has been used to pay Santa Rosa police, fire fighters
A RESOLUTION OF THE CITY COUNCIL OF THE CITY OF WATSONVILLE ADOPTING THE FISCAL YEAR 2014-2015 PUBLIC SAFETY SALES TAX MEASURE BUDGET APPROPRIATION OF $1,260,000 TO THE POLICE PUBLIC SAFETY FUND AND $840,000 TO THE FIRE PUBLIC SAFETY FUND CONTINGENT ON VOTER APPROVAL OF THE TRANSACTIONS AND USE TAX: PUBLIC SAFETY SALES TAX MEASURE ORDINANCE IMPOSING A ONE-HALF OF ONE PERCENT (0.50%) TRANSACTIONS AND USE TAX: PUBLIC SAFETY SALES TAX MEASURE ON JUNE 3, 2014
WHEREAS
Los Angeles County, CA City of Commerce
Measure AA. Shall the ordinance imposing a one half of one percent (½%) transactions and use (sales) tax to offset severe state budget cuts and provide funding for such things as police and fire service
Manteca currently has a half-cent sales tax known as Measure M that covers the salaries of 23 full-time police and firefighters.
Possible sales tax could fund Lathrop fire services
The Measure �O� Vital City Services transactions (sales) and use tax was approved by 65 percent of the voters on November 4, 2008. It was implemented in Oxnard business establishments in April, 2009,
The purpose of the Measure �O� ordinance is to provide enhanced levels of vital city services including police, fire and emergency response
San Carlos Sales Tax Initiative Finally Has a Name: Measure U…
.5% Sales Tax Increase
We’ve talked in past articles on this site about the proposed 0.5% sales tax increase that we’ll be asked to vote on in the November Election. It’s pretty straightforward:
• Yes or No — hike the local sales tax to 9.75% for a six-year period to raise money for vital City functions?
This is a pretty popular form of funding for emergency services in California. I’m with John, Press Release, Lewis, and any others that want to save our fire and emt services. Nobody else seems to have a any fix ideas.
Chuck, your examples are for additional “city” sales taxes, not a “countywide” sales tax! You go deeper in the wrong direction when you try to apply it to the needs of a special district like ECCFPD which is neither a city department or a county one.
In the future if you are going to invest time and research, make sure you know what you doing before you Google! The answer you get is going to depend entirely on the question(s) you asked.
You get an “A” for effort but an “F” for knowledge of the subject matter.
Chuck, the self proclaimed common sense commando strikes again!
Did the word “city” completely escape you on that list Chuck? Do you think Santa Rosa taxed their residents and then spent the money in Eureka? Think Oxnard taxed their citizens and then spent it in San Diego?
Probably not.
Would you like me to elaborate or can you see the error in your latest attempt to float a plan?
But let’s at least back the clown car up for a second. Explain to the readers why you and your buddies were so loud and proud about shooting down Measures O and S that we needed to support fire. Now you have to go through all these illegal contortions trying to make people think you actually care about fire.
Either you’re BSing the voters or you’re BSing yourselves.
Which is it?
12 days in, and you dudes still going strong.
Indefatigable is what you all are.
Or… maybe ya’all just don’t have jobs. I can’t quite figure that one out… either way, it is entertaining.
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